We need better information

These discussions about what an online right should look like seems to miss several points. There are distinct problems, and they need to be handled seperately. Some of these problems need to be solved organically, some will require time, but some can be solved somewhat mechanically.

One of the things that we need to solve immediately and may be susceptible to a mechanical solution is the crisis of information. The crisis of information is that righty information outlets are having incrementally less influence on the news cycle than lefty ones. The chart is from this WSJ story about the rise of the lefty blogs and specifically Huffington Post vis-a-vis Drudge. TPM, Chris Cillizza, Howard Kurtz, Halperin and others have been talking about this also.

On the list above, Townhall, Michelle Malkin, Newsbusters, and Redstate were the only sites to demonstrate triple-digit growth during the last election period, and only Redstate's and Newsbusters' was truly explosive. (full disclosure: I am a front-page contributor to both of those)

But I don't want to focus on traffic, but rather a related question: who drives the news cycle? This used to be Drudge and still is to a great degree. But any experience watching this electoral cycle will tell you that TPM and Huffington Post are essential in setting narratives and forcing campaigns and other political actors to respond to specific reported and sourced information and distributing it quickly. With that in mind, let's look at something Mark Tapscott said:

But I want to offer a third essential element in addition to punditry and activism. The RightRoots must make a top priority of equiping vastly more of our sites with the reportorial and investigative skills required to dig up and present credible exposes, fact-based analyses and concrete news stories.

In short, we've complained about liberal media bias for decades, but now that the mainstream media is steadily being displaced by online media, many of us need to become ..... journalists, or capable of doing the online analogy of traditional journalism, particularly in its investigative phase.

I would state this slightly differently. Stories are started online with HuffPo and TPM. They are completed on TV and in the newspapers. We are playing in no part of that process. One of the reasons for that is that there is no reliable place to go for fact-based conservative perspective.

This is something that we could do now. There are enough talented reporters to start training and mentorship programs for more. These people could play in the news cycle. This would not necessarily require donors to dump money on "bloggers". Rather the people would be established journalists with records.

Other parts of rebuilding the right as a coherent ideological and electoral force will depend on other things (like a coherent ideological framework linked to coherent policies). But this we can do relatively quickly and start demonstrating immediate results by attacking the terrible policies of a Democratic Congress and, potentially, a Democratic White House.

 

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Credibility is a big factor

Jumping on and running with stories like the GOP staffer supposedly attacked without sufficiently exploring the situation makes the site pumping the story look like idiots.   Especially with overwhelming evidence ( backwards B ) that the story may be false.

Agreed

This is already being done by a few of the bloggers.  HotAir.com has been linking to these stories routinely.  However, you are correct there is no full mechanism and no recognized credibility/credentials.

I've noticed that the traditonal journalists are increasingly relying upon others to do their researching job anyways and this will futher reduce thier jobs to become what they are now, the collectors of investigative news.

The problem will still be that these investigative websites will be labelled conservative by those that present the news.  But if they are good and balanced investigations, the labelling effect should be minimized.

Let the process begin!

Driving Information

I believe that one of the reasons that HuffPo and TPM drive news stories is the media are left-leaning and those are the sites they read themselves.  How much good could it do to get RedState or Townhall to start investigative stories if no one in the media will read them?

liberal MSM and their web-extension

I believe that one of the reasons that HuffPo and TPM drive news stories is the media are left-leaning and those are the sites they read themselves.  How much good could it do to get RedState or Townhall to start investigative stories if no one in the media will read them?

BINGO WE HAVE A WINNER!!

These blogs have increased their following because the other parts of the liberal media are actively promoting them. They have become an extension of the liberal MSM complex. As such, the liberal media is cultivating their own 'major-media-sphere' and excluding the right. I've seen multiple examples of

HuffPo is actively promoted at MS-DNC via media references to it. Olbie is a hack, he just reads the script that dKos has written up for him. NYTimes runs an article on 'media bias' and use as their 'watchdog' ... Media Matters (oy vey!). Let me know the last time a Free Republic 'freeper' got a respectable interview in MSNBC, or the last time Newsbusters got a front page newspaper plug.

Now it doesnt help that right-blog are 99% opeds and less than 1% journalism or innovation, but really, even when we DO have a groundbreaking find - eg RatherGate, busting up phony AP pics from Israel/Hezbollah war, Obama&Wright/Ayers/Frank Davis Marshall - the MSM cone of silence is is profound.

If there is any actionable response on this, it would be:

First, continue to cultivate right-web-journalism; even if the liberal MSM wont touch this stuff, we can push it through our channels. It will punch through.

Second, cultivate more links, unity and cross-fertilization; no righty-blog is an island unto itself, but part of a wider network. Build the network.

Third, expose liberal media bias on the web as well as off. Just pointing it out helps alert people to look for 'balance'.

 

 

 

maybe there was liberal media bias

ages ago.

when you sound like something out of Scooby Doo, you lose credibility.

 

Media Moguls want McCain to win. Failing that, they want a surviving republican party.

Who would participate?

I would state this slightly differently. Stories are started online with HuffPo and TPM. They are completed on TV and in the newspapers. We are playing in no part of that process. One of the reasons for that is that there is no reliable place to go for fact-based conservative perspective.

This is something that we could do now. There are enough talented reporters to start training and mentorship programs for more. These people could play in the news cycle. This would not necessarily require donors to dump money on "bloggers". Rather the people would be established journalists with records.

No doubt there should be a counterbalance to HuffPo, DailyKos, etc. and certainly the left has a headstart in establishing its turf. But are there really lots of talented reporters who would be willing to participate in a right-leaning Internet presence? Are there enough of them to report from all the locations where stories might originate? Are you suggesting that established reporters "moonlight" while working for a traditional media outlet?

 

HuffPo and TPM have staff

Real journalists. Pay them. That's the only way.

tulza wasn't broken by a paid journalist

you lose if you can't find credible volunteers who by damn should be working for a fucking newspaper. GrannyDoc, Devilstower, Darksyde on kos spring to mind. And they're worthwhile reading, even if all you're learning about is Breton Woods.

what media do we "feed" with this raw material?

Beyond Fox News, the NY Post, and the editorial page of the WSJ, what established media outlets are likely to follow up on the stuff we find out? We'd best try and develop some additional media venues or we are going to be at the mercy of Rupert Murdoch's good graces 

You forgot the Washington Times

but yeah beyond those traditional media outlets, I'm not sure who would want any information online conserative journalists could feed them.  The so-called Mainstream Media is totally in the tank for the Obamacrats, and every story is filitered for their benefit, and even negative stories about Obama are spinned positive light.  Sean Hannity is right when he says this is the year journalism died, and I would that the zombie we see of it corpse is becoming the American Pravda.

I never understood why we didn't go to second tier papers

in swing state markets like Detroit, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh et al and find journalists there eager for "scoops" and try running our good oppo through them. They are eager for bylines, the first day coverage would influence swing voters, and once a serious newspaper ran with the story it would have credibility for wire services and TV networks.

I recall in '04 some web site had pretty good evidence Kerry had invented meetings with foreign leaders that hadn't occurred, but they fed the Wash. Times and the story died then and there.  We are not going to sell the top tier papers and the NY Post and Wash. Times are thought to be in the tank. Need to go to other venues--and frankly-- not use them so often they join the Rupert properties as being overtly identified with the Right. 

local media outlet outreach a good idea but ...

It's a great insight. Local papers are not dying out like the majors, and the readership is big. The ability to get in with op-eds or stories is greater, and opportunity to link between web and dead-tree is there.

Problem is, journalism is practically dead at the 2nd tier places. You read our local Statesman and its mostly cut-n-paste from AP and NYTimes wire/news stories, and a little extra content from Cox Newspapers thrown in. Dinosaur media is retrenching big time. Its an opportunity but a challenge.

What we really need is a conservative news service, eg, like CNS but maybe with web-derived content, and feed stories into the journalistic ether through a credible channel. One-off and amateur stuff wont go very far because the local papers are too strapped and underresourced to make anything of stories that are anything less than 100% in the can.

All JMHO, I'm an observer and not in the business itself so take with grain o salt. I heard a speech from a small newpaper guy (as in 10,000 circulation) that indicated they WOULD go for stories submitted from good written sources and that something along these lines is doable.

Market forces?

If the media is in the tank, I'd ask: why? If you believe in market forces, and all the media (except the WSJ and others listed above) are liberal, doesn't that indicate that there's a market for liberal views? If there were sufficient demand for conservative news, then they'd want this information.

So, which is it?

You miss the point entirely

The tarditional media is dying specifically because it is liberal.  The vast majority of consumers have gotten tired of its bias.  They are looking for alternatives.  Thus its marketshare is down and advertisers are starting to look elsewhere.

point rather undermined

by the more citizen driven internet numbers posted above. Kos gets traffic, 538 gets traffic (fantastic to see a link to them here, btw)

Good points

The left has been battling the same issues over radio/talk show coverage for years.  Air America is a good start, but the right has such a foundation that much, much more will be needed.

The left needed an outlet, found it online, and has built a very strong foundation for itself.  I susbscribe to many liberal blogs, but have yet to be able to find many right blogs of the same quality.  (anything, and I mean ANYTHING, involving Malkin, Coulter, Drudge fails miserably)  I have found a few (Sullivan, NextRight), but I'd like to find more.

Any suggestions on any fact-based quality righty blogs out there that you want to give this diehard liberal (but fiscal centrist) would be greatly appreciated.

 

you might want to check out

Dr. David Brin's blog. ;-)

The HuffPo has something we don't...

Money.  Huffington has lots of it and so do many of her liberal friends.  Its not an issue for them.  She can raise all she needs.  So can Soros and his Daily Kos. 

["The RightRoots must make a top priority of equip'ing vastly more of our sites with the reportorial and investigative skills required to dig up and present credible exposes, fact-based analyses and concrete news stories."]

Key word here is "investigative".  We have to investigate the left & MSM just as they investigate us. And report on them.  Believe me we'd find an almost infinite supply of juicy, factual news stories to report.  We need to follow them around, investigate their finances, look closely into their past.  Its time to let them know that in this world, if one lives in a glass house  one shouldn't throw rocks.   Problem is we don't have the money it'd take to build this sort of org or to pay for  the professional services/ resources necessary.  Deep investigations are needed to uncover much of the illegal  and sleazy activities of the left and MSM. 

So why don't we have the money?  I say that those conservatives out there with massive sums of cash are  unpatriotic.  They deserve only contempt.  I  respect Huffington and Soros even though I hate what they stand for.  Because they put their money where their mouth is.  Those moneyed few on "our" conservative side are far too cowardly to make any sort of stand for what they believe in.  I spit on them.  Darvin Dowdy

scaife included?

n/t

Money?

HuffPo may have started with money, just as Bill O'Reilly's site started with money behind it.  But the others (Daily Kos, Americablog, etc) pretty much started off as labors of love, with the blogger(s) working on their own time, with their own limited resources.  It was not until they got a following, a following built by supplying quality information, that they started getting donations and ad revenue.

So spit on your rich buddies if you want.  But to be effective, instead read the blogs, contribute to the good ones (fiscally if possible, and with your own worthwhile comments and analysis), and pass word on to others that "these blogs are good ones - read them."

That's BS and you know it...

...there's all sorts of left wing and foreign money going into these radical left anti-US/Constitution hating blogs.  "Labor of Love" my Bu__!  Labor of Hate is more like it.  Thats the only motivation the democrats have anymore. Pure hate.

Someone needs to step up and help the Movement Conservatives in their struggle for survival.  Which is not to say that those who frequent the blogs shouldn't pony up w/a few bucks every so often.  But that's only going to be enough to keep the lights on.  Plus there are so many more aspects of the movement other than just blogs that need financing.

Here's an example of what I'm talking about:  http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/02/geos.html

An example of both the left and the Rino's (both slime-my opinion) both dumping massive amounts of $$ into orgs to promote their agenda's.  Certainly there has to be some big money folks who are solid, nationalistic conservatives who'd help get the Movement Conservatives back on track.  Or as we're calling it here "rightroots".   DD 

correction...

...in my above comment, the link, I described it as an article about the left and Rino's funding their various org's.  In retrospect I must admit Sheldon Adelson and Freedoms Watch can't really be classified as Rino's.  I'm sure there's some Rino's mixed in the org but for the most part Sheldon is......Cool.  Far as I can tell.  I retract my Rino description of Freedoms Watch.  Could this be an org that "rightroots" could turn to for help?  DD 

Darn shame....

Pretty neat - up until this past post of yours, the contents of this thread were adult/mature observations and discussions on what should be or has been done.  Then, you hit the pits with your kindergarten "slime" remark.  Not quite Godwin level, but pretty pathetic....

Enjoy your life - I'll be happy to add to this discussion again when your level of discourse reaches puberty again.

ad hominem against DD's truthful statement

How childish of you to berate DD for speaking the truth:

An example of both the left and the Rino's (both slime-my opinion) both dumping massive amounts of $$ into orgs to promote their agenda's.

This is generally true. Media Matters, moveon.org, CREW, the Colorado Project, the list goes on of this modus operandi, not to mention the left-wing foundation money or PIRG groups  that generates 'studies' for leftleaning media consumption. Or the environmental groups, exposed recently as little more than arms of the Democrat machine. Many of the left-funded orgs have an explicit agenda of creating material to skew the media. The liberal MSM laps up the biased garbage these outlets create because it fits their own biases. Corruption by Democrats is ignored while 'scandals' often out of nothing against Republicans (like the non-scandal troopergate against Palin).

And you attacking him personally with garbage like:

Then, you hit the pits with your kindergarten "slime" remark. ... I'll be happy to add to this discussion again when your level of discourse reaches puberty again.

Be our guest and stay off the threads if you think name-calling posters is 'mature' and calling out the slime tactics of the left is not.

 

Thanks FT...

... their motto is "plausible deniability".  But we all know how intense and well financed the opposition is. 

The folks running this board must feel good. The left see's the NR as such a threat that they have to send their attack dogs over and attempt to disrupt things.  I'd like to stop here and give the NextRight folks an atta-boy.  Pat on the back.  They must be doing something "right".  Ha! DD

Wait a minute...

Did you just accuse someone of an ad hominem attack, and then defend the original comment (calling someone "slime") as truth? That word, I do not think it means what you think it means.

They started as labors of love and converted to for-pay

There's been a shift.

No shame in getting paid, Soren...

..."A workman is worthy of his pay"  The trick is, I think that if the payer tries to influence the content then one has to toss the pay back in their face.  But, true, thats where the problems arise.  If one gets used to having that pay coming in, its hard to let go of.   But I've seen people do it.  One must be resolute and I think the GOP lost its ability to be so.  Movement Conservatives must remain resolute. DD

All this really means is that their blogs have been successful.

At least in appealing to their base.  So much so that they know they can demand payment for their product rather than offering it for free.  The left loves making a profit (even as they demonize it as selfishness and greed) they are just hypocrites about it.  But then again when are they not being hypocritical?

some of us are limited....

as I've noted, the advantage the cyber Right has over the ossified Beltway GOP establishment is we all pretty much have real lives in real American communities; hence , we are more "reality based" than some of the pipe dreams and slick merchandizing from the DC professionals.

But someone like me--with a job, child, wife and mortgage---is not in a position to spend the day poring over paper records, hounding sources over the phone for tips or "off the record" quotes or tracking political opponents with a video camera.

That said, with all due respect, the sorts of people with the time to do that are going not have specific knowledge about some relevant issue areas that our citizen journalists have.  Now my forte of late has been Senator Dodd. http://thenextright.com/category/blog-tags/chris-dodd   Why?

a) there might be a hundred or so folks who know CT politics better than I do

b) there are thousands of people who know mortgage finance and foreclosure law better than I do.

c) Hardly any of them are the same person.

In order to explain Senator Dodd, you need to know both.  There's my added value.  And for a guy like this, there's enough open source stuff findable via search engines to provide a detailed look at the guy's agenda and missteps.   Not every newsworthy subject is gonna have this sort of thick paper trail, but plenty do.. 

So, in order that this endeavor not yield the same poorly reasoned work product that J-school grads have inflicted on major media, it is essential that we maintain the skill sets and grounding of the citizen journalists if sites likes these are augmented by paid reporters. The journalist profession may know news; but very few know economics. And it shows.  

All are limited...

...but some, like Ironman here and many on this board, are enlightened.  Enlightened people attract the same.  Ironman says: " There's my added value."   Darn right.  (no pun)  A collection of enlightened, talented people have value.  And if thats true, someone ought to pay for their time or at least to help them get started.   I have to believe that there's some enlightened one out there wanting to contribute but all they have to contribute is money.   DD